Delta Virtual Airlines Water Cooler

Delta Virtual Airlines Water Cooler | Airline Operations | Route Plotting

DVA11274
Captain, B737-800

Joined on January 26 2013

Western United States

13 legs, 32.1 hours
12 legs, 31.2 hours ACARS

Posted onPost created on February 08 2013 00:30 ET by Nareg Haladjian

Hi everyone. I was sort of confused with the route plotting on this website. Sometimes I would like to plot my route a while before flying, but the wind direction will most likely change. This makes the active runway different than what I have originally planned on the website. I know on the ACARS that I can change the active runway, the SID, and the STAR. Would the difference between the ACARS and the planned route on the website cause any problems? If so, is there a way to change your planned route for a certain flight? Thanks :).

Nareg Haladjian

Captain, B737-800

DVA10641
Assistant Chief Pilot, B757-200
OLP

Joined on March 29 2012
50 State Club
Globetrotter
Million Mile Club
US Mountaineer Club
US Coastal Club
DVA Ten-Year Anniversary
Flying Colonel
Online Fifteen Century
Everett 1500 Club
Events Quintuple Century Club

Rosemount, MN USA

1,987 legs, 4,456.2 hours
1,865 legs, 3,929.2 hours online
1,967 legs, 4,422.4 hours ACARS
638 legs, 1,290.5 hours event
18 legs dispatched, 157.2 hours

Posted onPost created on February 08 2013 01:27 ET by Jason Boche

I don't worry about rwy numbers in ACARS or the route plotter. Most SIDs support all airport rwys so that means wind changes leading to runway changes don't always result in SID changes. There are some exceptions such as Boston which has rwy specific SIDs as well as Atlanta which has RNAV departures that will have RNAV waypoint changes depending on which rwy you're taking off from even though the SID name is the same. I don't recall if the DVA route plotter handles RNAV departures. Even if you were able to predict the winds or the winds didn't change, there is no guarantee you'll guess the correct rwy where parallels exist. A perfect example of this again is Atlanta where they'll be departing 3 different parallel rwys. Minneapolis typically departs 2 parallel rwys but in that case they are not RNAV departures so the SID and waypoints are the same no matter which rwy is used.

Anyway, I would't lose too much sleep over it. I've learned that sometimes you can plan only so far ahead but you have to be ready for change at a moment's notice. I think that is part of the enjoyment I get out of this hobby. Have the plates ready if the winds change. Even if you have the winds right, ATC can ask you to change your SID to a different departure. It doesn't happen often but it does happen. Ultimately you're responsible for flying the assigned departures and arrivals correctly.

Jason Boche

Assistant Chief Pilot, B757-200

DVA11221
Captain, B777-200
OLP

Joined on January 01 2013
50 State Club
Century Club

Issaquah, WA

114 legs, 423.9 hours
37 legs, 94.4 hours online
114 legs, 423.9 hours ACARS

Posted onPost created on February 08 2013 09:24 ET by Shaun Oneil

Aye, Jason's right about being ready for changes, particularly if you plan on flying online. I flew KBOS-KJFK the other day and during my pre-flight I planned on a 22R departure with an RNAV DP (SSOXS2, I think). Right before I was going to push and start BOS_GND came online and when I called for the clearance they assigned 33L and the LOGAN6 depature. No big deal, just pulled up the new DP and taxied out to 33L. Worst case scenario is just ask ATC if you can get what you originally planned ... as long as they aren't too busy, they would probably grant the request.

Shaun Oneil

Captain, B777-200

DVA11274
Captain, B737-800

Joined on January 26 2013

Western United States

13 legs, 32.1 hours
12 legs, 31.2 hours ACARS

Posted onPost created on February 08 2013 12:26 ET by Nareg Haladjian

Shaun Oneil wrote:

Aye, Jason's right about being ready for changes, particularly if you plan on flying online. I flew KBOS-KJFK the other day and during my pre-flight I planned on a 22R departure with an RNAV DP (SSOXS2, I think). Right before I was going to push and start BOS_GND came online and when I called for the clearance they assigned 33L and the LOGAN6 depature. No big deal, just pulled up the new DP and taxied out to 33L. Worst case scenario is just ask ATC if you can get what you originally planned ... as long as they aren't too busy, they would probably grant the request.

Jason Boche wrote:

I don't worry about rwy numbers in ACARS or the route plotter. Most SIDs support all airport rwys so that means wind changes leading to runway changes don't always result in SID changes. There are some exceptions such as Boston which has rwy specific SIDs as well as Atlanta which has RNAV departures that will have RNAV waypoint changes depending on which rwy you're taking off from even though the SID name is the same. I don't recall if the DVA route plotter handles RNAV departures. Even if you were able to predict the winds or the winds didn't change, there is no guarantee you'll guess the correct rwy where parallels exist. A perfect example of this again is Atlanta where they'll be departing 3 different parallel rwys. Minneapolis typically departs 2 parallel rwys but in that case they are not RNAV departures so the SID and waypoints are the same no matter which rwy is used.

Anyway, I would't lose too much sleep over it. I've learned that sometimes you can plan only so far ahead but you have to be ready for change at a moment's notice. I think that is part of the enjoyment I get out of this hobby. Have the plates ready if the winds change. Even if you have the winds right, ATC can ask you to change your SID to a different departure. It doesn't happen often but it does happen. Ultimately you're responsible for flying the assigned departures and arrivals correctly.

Alright. Thank you both for clearing this up for me.

Nareg Haladjian

Captain, B737-800

DVA7636
Senior Captain, L-1011-100
OLP

Joined on August 11 2009
50 State Club
Events Double Century Club
Burbank 250 Club
Quincentenary Club
Online Quintuple Century Club
Globetrotter
Black Pearl Club
DVA Ten-Year Anniversary

"Uses "Sparkly Eyes" Technique on ATC"
Channelview, TX USA

588 legs, 1,196.5 hours
572 legs, 1,164.8 hours online
586 legs, 1,192.9 hours ACARS
287 legs, 572.1 hours event

Posted onPost created on February 10 2013 10:25 ET by Tracy Norris

Nareg, like you, I prefer to plan my flights in the morning and fly them after work.

Without knowing in advance what the weather might be, I'll plan the "guts" of the route such as first fix, waypoints, final fix, planned altitude and diversion airport and save them in a text file on a thumb drive or network share (e.g. KATL-TLPL.txt). This way, the majority of the planning is already complete. Here's an example of what goes in one of the files:

----------------------
DVA421 Leg 1 B737-800 Atlanta GA (KATL) to St Lucia West Indies (TLPL) 09:45 ET 15:10 AT 4:24 0 1,752 nm
MCN J45 OMN J79 MALET V3 MLB V492 ANGEE BR62V ZFP BR1L GTK A555 TUUNA G633 COY A555 ILURI UA555 FOF
(TFFF) FL390
----------------------

The first line is from the "Find a Flight" section of DVA to my destination.
Second line is the plotted route from another web service (I prefer http://www.simroutes.com/fb2/showplans.aspx or http://rfinder.asalink.net/free/ )
Third line contains my alternate and planned flight level

When I get home from work, I check the weather, load the text file and paste the waypoints into the DVA route plotter as well as the other info, select the preferred SID and STAR and I'm ready to go.

I prefer this method because it plans the majority of the flight in advance and gives me the day to go over the route in my head during idle moments. It easily shaves 10-15 minutes off of my flight setup and decreases the workload prior to flight.

During the course of the week I may plan several flights for the weekend, holidays, etc and save them as well (with the flight time in the filename). That way if I have an uninterrupted block of time I can pick a flight duration that matches that and off I go.

Hope this helps in your flight planning wink

Tracy Norris

Senior Captain, L-1011-100

DVA12104
Senior Captain, B727-200

Joined on January 24 2013
50 State Club
Globetrotter
Tri-Jet Triumph
US Coastal Club
US Mountaineer Club
Everett Bi-Millennium Club
Two Million Mile Club
Tri-Millennium Club
DVA Ten-Year Anniversary

""The white zone has always been for loading or unloading..""
Las Cruces, NM

3,338 legs, 6,583.0 hours
3,269 legs, 6,426.5 hours ACARS

Posted onPost created on July 21 2014 18:56 ET by Brian Donaldson

Hello my friends.

"I'll plan the "guts" of the route such as first fix, waypoints, final fix, planned altitude and diversion airport" -TRACY MORRIS (February 10 2013)

I've been perusing the water cooler with regard to this question. In pre-flight, I'm looking at departure & arrival plates for the locations as well
as en route to set up a detailed flight plan to download then fly. I really enjoy this challenge.

Can a DVA pilot add a plotted route to the DVA website..?? In the flight plan plotter step, can a saved plotted route be submitted so it is in the
pull down selection in saved routes for other pilots as well as myself for future flights..??

Brian Donaldson

Senior Captain, B727-200

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